GRT FKT - travel itinerary

[ericcharette]

Hello!

As an ultrarunner and having grown up in the UP and graduated from MTU, I have been fascinated with running the Greenstone Ridge Trail. From my research, it looks like the fastest known time (FKT) from Windigo to Lookout Louise is 10 hours 17 minutes (but this is sketchy, with no official details behind the record, so its validity is in question). Having just run rim to rim to rim in the Grand Canyon for fun in 11 hours (41 miles) I think that I can run the GRT in well under 10 hours.

Anyway, my questions are numerous, but to start I need to know if this travel schedule is possible. I have researched the options a hundred times over and as an engineer this is a complex problem to solve!

Day 1 (has to be a tuesday based on the Voyaguer 2 schedule)
- Use Royale Air service to fly from Houghton to Windigo
- Camp at Windigo
- Leave camping gear at Windigo

Day 2 (has to be a Wednesday based on the Voyaguer 2 schedule)
- Start predawn from Windigo on the GRT and run to Lookout Louise (41 miles or so)
- My crew would take the Voyaguer 2 from Windigo to Rock Harbor with essentials for the night
- Either arrange water taxi service (from the Rock Harbor lodge folks) to pick me up at Hidden Lake dock and take me back to Rock Harbor lodge OR hike the 5 miles back to the southwest, then northeast to Rock Harbor Lodge (not preferred)
- Stay at Rock Harbor Lodge

Day 3 (has to be a Thursday based on the Voyaguer 2 schedule)
- Take the Voyaguer 2 from Rock Harbor back to Windigo, arriving at 12:30pm
- Pack up camping gear
- Royale air service fly from Windigo back to Houghton

I have researched running this Rock Harbor to Windigo, but I have to say that after running 10 hours, I would prefer to sleep in a bed with a hot shower, meal and a cold adult beverage at the Lodge!

I am open to any feedback on the best way to make this one-way run happen more efficiently. Cost is not a problem.

I have attached my hand sketch of the different travel options, costs, times of departure, arrival, and days of operation for a June/July FKT attempt.

Thanks! Eric

[Vandy]

One thing to think about is abandoning Windigo after the first night, and have your crew bring all your gear with them. Then, you won't have to worry about getting back there to pick it up. The seaplane will pick you up in Rock Harbor as the 2nd leg of a round trip flight.

Others can chime in, but I believe it is possible to rent canoes for half and full days out of Rock Harbor so your crew could meet you, and you wouldn't be at the mercy of the water taxi.

Water supplies along the Greenstone are limited. You may want to think about sending part of your crew off from various points and caching some for you.

Sounds like quite the adventure. Keep us posted on the planning and execution!

[Ingo]

Sounds like a good basic plan to me. A couple thoughts:
- You can fly into Windigo and out of Rock Harbor, avoiding the need to get back to Windigo. In fact, I don't know any reason not to.
- You could then make your Day 2 be any day the Voyageur II makes an outbound trip. In July when they do a full schedule that will be 3 times a week on Mon, Wed. and Sat. Will need to check their exact dates and schedules.
- If you stick to the original plan of returning to Windigo, you can't leave the camping gear in a shelter and would need to arrange storage with the store there (same folks as the R.H. lodge).
- The water taxi from Hidden Lake to R.H. sounds like the best option.
- Before you set a date I'd wait for some reports on trail conditions and winter blowdowns. Last year there were excessive trees down and going in June may have had some issues.
- Assuming you will have contingency plans for weather and/or injury. Will you have communication with your crew?

And finally, I'd spend an extra day or 2 on the island! Flying out of R.H. may help that too.

[Ingo]

Second thoughts on getting from Hidden Lake to R.H. Since you have a crew and said money is not an issue, just have them rent a motor boat from the lodge. It will be more flexible, more room, and quicker than a canoe, and avoid the timing issues--assuming your crew are friends who are willing to wait . And less weather dependent than a canoe also.

[ericcharette]

Boat rental is a great idea. My crew is only there to support me (its my Dad) and I am sure he would be willing as then he could hike up to Lake Louise and see me finish, take pictures, etc. I will add that to my notes.

[ericcharette]

Here would be a revised itinerary.

Day 1 (has to be a tuesday based on the Voyaguer 2 schedule)
- Use Royale Air service to fly from Houghton to Windigo
- Camp at Windigo

Day 2 (has to be a Wednesday based on the Voyaguer 2 schedule)
- Start predawn from Windigo on the GRT and run to Lookout Louise (41 miles or so)
- My crew would take the Voyaguer 2 from Windigo to Rock Harbor and camping gear
- Motor boat rental from the Rock Harbor lodge folks) and my crew will pick me up at Hidden Lake dock and take me back to Rock Harbor lodge
- Stay at Rock Harbor Lodge

Day 3 (has to be a Thursday based on the Voyaguer 2 schedule)
- Royale air service fly from Rock Harbor back to Houghton

[Midwest Ed]

From my research, it looks like the fastest known time (FKT) from Windigo to Lookout Louise is 10 hours 17 minutes (but this is sketchy, with no official details behind the record, so its validity is in question). Having just run rim to rim to rim in the Grand Canyon for fun in 11 hours (41 miles) I think that I can run the GRT in well under 10 hours.

I would think about trying to do whatever is reasonably required to be able to document an "official" elapsed time. Is an independent observer(s) required? I'm sure you have more knowledge than I do about various governing authorities in such matters and what they will or won't accept. Are you going to carry a hand held GPS to log the excursion? That would be interesting to see, including all the elevation changes. If you do indeed break a record it would be nice for there to be some sort of permanent and accepted documentation.

It will be interesting to see if there will be (or how much there might be) recognition or cooperation from the NPS. This is sort of an "off use" exercise for a designated wilderness area and I'm guessing some people would not want to see this sort of thing potentially grow into something bigger than a wilderness area can handle.

As others have advised, I'm sure you could avoid the need to return to Windigo. There is, by the way, new housing options opening up in Windigo if a reverse direction pursuit is desired. Some new rent-able cabins are becoming available and I hear they will be more cost effective than the RH Lodge. Try the same concessionaire as RH Lodge for details.

Happy running and good luck.

[ericcharette]

There are "official rules" which are guidelines for this type of thing posted at http://fastestknowntime.proboards.com/

- Announce your intentions in advance. Like a true gentleman, pay your respects to those who came before you, and tell them what you intend to attempt and when.
- Be an open book. Invite anyone to come and watch or, better yet, participate. This makes your effort more fun and any result more believable.
- Record your event. Write down everything immediately upon completion. Memory doesn't count.

I have done a few other FKTs and we followed these rules and they have been accepted.

There is no official documented fastest time. The only record I could find of anyone even doing this in < 24 hours was someone who posted on a backpacker.com website with his username indicating 10 hrs and change. I will have this properly documented by each trail section, thus creating a standard for people to chase in the future.

I plan on letting the NPS know (I have a friend who works on the west end of the island in the summer) but to be honest, the logistics of doing this run end to end are so miserable that I can't see many others trying it. Most people fork off at Franklin and head down to Rock Harbor.

If there is lodging at Windigo (cabins) thought would be freaking awesome. My 60 year old dad is excited about crewing for me, but not so excited about staying in a tent for the night! Do you think these are operated by the Rock Harbor lodge folks?

[drobarge]

From George Hite's logbook at Rock Hbr June 20 2008: " TheAmygdaloid enforcement ranger ran from Rock Harbor to Windego in 7hrs 8 minutes" George was an AVID runner late in life and I'm not suprised he noted this.
I'm sure with a little reasearch we could find out who this ranger was.

[Ingo]

The only record I could find of anyone even doing this in < 24 hours was someone who posted on a backpacker.com website with his username indicating 10 hrs and change.

When I worked at R.H. in '79 two employees, college aged females, hiked it in a day. Don't remember the time, but they arrived in Windigo using flashlights (opposite direction), so not record breaking.

If there is lodging at Windigo (cabins) thought would be freaking awesome. My 60 year old dad is excited about crewing for me, but not so excited about staying in a tent for the night! Do you think these are operated by the Rock Harbor lodge folks?

They were under construction last year at the end of July--just framed in at that point. Since there's only 1 concessionaire on the island (Rock Harbor Lodge), "Yes", I assume that they would be the ones to talk to. Also, the Washington Creek campground at Windigo has a bunch of shelters, which would probably appeal to your Dad. Odds are you would get one, but you would need to carry the tent just in case (1st come, 1st serve).

[Ingo]

Are you going to carry a hand held GPS to log the excursion? That would be interesting to see, including all the elevation changes.

Mike Tremblay's book has elevation graphs of all the trails (http://www.isleroyale.info).

[Ingo]

Boat rental is a great idea. My crew is only there to support me (its my Dad) and I am sure he would be willing as then he could hike up to Lake Louise and see me finish, take pictures, etc. I will add that to my notes.

Although you will probably beat him there, assuming all goes well. The Voyageur II doesn't get into R.H. until 3 p.m. CDT or so. In any case, do pre-arrange with the lodge to have the boat on the Tobin Harbor side--at times it's not a good idea to travel in those boats around Scoville Pt (been there, done that, been stupid, but managed to survive).

[ericcharette]

Yes I would be wearing GPS for distance/time but also be carrying a back up timing source (watch) just in case.

The report of "TheAmygdaloid enforcement ranger ran from Rock Harbor to Windego in 7hrs 8 minutes" is interesting. I would love to hear more about this to see how valid it was. I don't think this time is out of the question as for 40.1 miles it would be 10:40 pace. I have run 50km trail on harder courses in times ranging from 3:53 to 4:30 and hilly road 40 milers in 5 1/2 hours before. If this is the current "record" it just means running harder, as opposed to taking my time and just trying to come in under what I thought was the old fastest time.

Any way to contact George Hite?

Thanks!

[IncaRoads]

On 1 November 2011, George Hite, 80, of Eagle Harbor passed away at his home.

http://www.eagleharborweb.net/

[ericcharette]

I have contacted the NPS for IR to inquire about who the park ranger might have been in 2008 for Amygdaloid.

I also searched through George's site (though I did not know him, I was saddened by his passing after all of his contributions) http://www.eagleharborweb.net/ and could not find any information a journal entry for June of 2008.

drobarge where were you able to dig up this information? It is fairly important as this will change my entire approach and training. Thanks...