QUESTIONS!!!!!! first venture to IR!

[nicadimus]

Hi Ya'll!!!!

Preparing for my first venture to IR this June...taking with my Husband/ 12 yr old son and 16 yr old nephew!!! Being the BRAINS of this operation(i'm the only one with any sort of camping/packing experience) I will be planning everything

My previous experience has been packing/canoeing into the BWCA...most of the gear for this was not necessarily light in nature(big bulky/waterproof portage packs)...bear proof food tub...coleman stove...etc..so I'm basicly needing to re-stock everything!!!! I'm hoping to plan a couple backpacking trips a year going forward so I'm looking for good recommendations for gear not only for this trip, but just good quality gear for the future also....

#1-packs...dumb question but what do the numbers mean on the descriptions for packs...64, 40, etc..I'm looking for packs for 7-day ventures on average...plus I'm a chic...so not sure if the "girl" packs really are awesome for chics? Does it matter?

#2-sleepingbags....I would love to plan trips for spring/summer/fall...taking those range of temps into consideration what should i be looking for??

#3-stoves...I'm not entirely sure my meal plan yet...I have no experience with freeze dried food(we spoiled ourselves with Spagetti dinners/burgers/or fresh fish in the BWCA)..but I'm thinking freeze dried should be an option for at least dinners...possibly some breakfasts(I hate oatneal)...I've read up on the fuel/stove debates and am thinking something small/lightweight...white gas..

#4-I would like to buy one hammock and give it a try, might work out kind of fun and we can rotate...sounds super comfy...recommendations? Do they come with bug nets?

#5- tarps? Lightweight?

#6- filters- any general recommendations?

#7- tents...

Thanks

Any and all recommendations are welcome..

FYI- I'm looking for awesome quality stuff...but saving cost would be nice also

[Ingo]

#1-packs...dumb question but what do the numbers mean on the descriptions for packs...64, 40, etc..I'm looking for packs for 7-day ventures on average...plus I'm a chic...so not sure if the "girl" packs really are awesome for chics? Does it matter?

You need to try them on, with weight, and find what's most comfortable for you. Whatever advice folks give you about brands doesn't mean a thing if it doesn't fit your body well. Go to an outdoors store (or 2) and bother the heck out of someone! Went through it myself this fall and ended up with something I didn't think I would because it fit me like a glove. The numbers are the size (volume) in liters. 60-70 would be typical for multi-day trips I think.

#2-sleepingbags....I would love to plan trips for spring/summer/fall...taking those range of temps into consideration what should i be looking for??

Generally add 10-15 degs to the rating, so if you think you'll be out in 30 deg weather, look at 15-20 deg bags. You can also consider a lighter bag and add a liner if you need it for colder weather. Look at "EN" ratings for temps, since those are done to a consistent standard. If they don't have them, then you can't trust the rating at all. And on the whole, women tend to need a warmer bag than men--it's biological, but I can't tell you why. If you trust yourself to keep it dry, a down bag is great for weight to warmth ratio.

#3-stoves...I'm not entirely sure my meal plan yet...I have no experience with freeze dried food(we spoiled ourselves with Spagetti dinners/burgers/or fresh fish in the BWCA)..but I'm thinking freeze dried should be an option for at least dinners...possibly some breakfasts(I hate oatneal)...I've read up on the fuel/stove debates and am thinking something small/lightweight...white gas..

I go strictly with freeze dried and oatmeal when backpacking, and take "real food" when canoeing. The simpler your meals are the simpler your gear can be (1 pot to boil water). I used white gas for 30 yrs but started using a canister stove this last year and love it (MSR Microrocket). Works great on high or low heat and only weighs a couple ounces. Probably won't go back unless I do some winter camping.

#5- tarps? Lightweight?

SIL tarps are the lightest, but pricey. I've gone cheap with a light blue-poly one, but consider it disposable. For the $5 it cost I figure I can buy a few. And it doesn't weigh any more than standard weight nylon ones. I do like my Kelty Noahs Tarp (medium size I think) which I use canoeing and car camping, but take the cheap, small 10 oz one backpacking if I think I'll want it.

#6- filters- any general recommendations?

I'm sold on the gravity feed kind. Have the Platypus, but Sawyer and others make them too. Fill the bag, hang it up, and you're done. If it starts slowing down, simple back flush it by raising the clean water bag higher.

If you're going to get serious about backpacking, and making the investment, pay attention to weight on everything! I don't count grams, but ounces certainly add up quickly. I find it hard to figure out right weight/comfort/economical compromises at times, but that's part of the fun.

[drobarge]

Here is a list of companies I just posted. everything here is top quality gear . A great place to start researching your new gear, enjoy

http://isleroyaleforums.com/viewtopic.p ... 326#p13326

[bergman]

Tents:
3-man tent for you and hubbie. Even if u guys are average size, its nice to have some extra room to keep gear dry, especially clothing. I really like my MSR Mutha Hubba 3-man, but i'm not sure of the weight, and i'm usually just paddling.

2-man for the boys. It can really be tough finding a decent flat/comfy spot to set up one large tent; the 2 tents give u more flexibility.

U will want some self-inflating mattresses 1 to 1.5" thick. The young guys could get away with 3/4 length mattresses but adults appreciate full-length. Weights can really vary. I bought a Neo-Air thermarest, but returned it as the material didnt seem that rugged and it reminded me of the cheapie beach rafts we floated on as a kid. I would spend more$ on the sleeping bags and less on the matts. A couple premium space blankets-one for each tent, to lay down on the tent floor on the inside, goes a long way toward staying warm & dry.

As u will be going in june, u will want to bring along a lighter down or similar (compressible?) winter jacket. Stuff it into a pillow case (50/50 cotton/poly) and walah(?): u have a camp pillow.

Try to avoid cotton clothing, esp. 100% cotton, remembering the old adage: "cotton kills". Its nice to have a couple cotton items to be comfy at camp & on nice days.

For the tent groundcloths, i buy a big roll of 8' wide black heavy duty (4mil thickness?) landscaping plastic, to make custom groundcloths. Not incredibly light but rock solid leakproof, and being black they dry quickly in the sun.

Almost forgot the most important tent info: be sure the tent's rainfly comes practically all the way to the ground, to protect u from rain driven sideways by a strong wind, or i suppose even from heavy rain coming straight down.

[Tom]

Two things that can make or break a trip: Footwear and pack fit.
If you don't have decent footwear (normally boots) that are broken in, they'll break you.
Pack fit: You can carry an amazing amount of weight in a properly fit pack. Also, an ill fit or adjusted pack, with just a little weight, can tire you out and make you sore. It's really one of those things that needs to be 'fit' to you.
Fortunately, I seem to recall you indicated you're coming from Minneapolis. You're surrounded by three REI stores, and have Midwest Mountaineering in the middle. As Ingo indicates, have them fit you, put weight in the pack, and just walk around the store. I'd recommend not even LOOKING at packs until they fit you, and they'll know what packs may or may not work for you. No sense falling in love with a certain style, only to discover that it's really not going to work for your body/back type.

Sleeping bag: Note, a bag appropriate for "summer" on Isle Royale is a common spring/fall/cooler season bag everywhere else . Getting a bag and liner (which might gain you 10 degrees) isn't a horrible way to go. A 20-30F range bag would keep you cozy, yet let you unzip if too warm, and still be fairly light and compact.

Stove: I'm old school, and also tend to use my stove outdoors in winter, as well, so I stick with a classic white gas stove. (It can burn other liquid fuels, as well.)
As a bonus (don't tell) you can also carefully splash a little white gas on a log or twigs when you want to get the fire started faster. There is undeniable convenience in isobutane, however.. Again, agreeing with Ingo, watch the preparation instructions on dehydrated food.
"Just add water, mix, wait 8 minutes." = YAY!
"Add water, mix, sauté until demiglace, gently whisk remainder of ingredients in another pan on medium low heat, simmering until done." = What the heck was I thinking.
I tend to bring Mountain House (taste is decent, prep is excellent) and Cache Lake. (Amazing taste, but a little more prep.)

From an economics perspective, don't overlook the REI branded stuff, especially tents and packs. (Remember: Only if the pack fits!) Normally a pretty good value proposition, although sometimes you give up a few bells and whistles.

[Vandy]

From a food perspective, I used http://www.packitgourmet.com/ my last trip. They were all various degrees of delicious and very easy to prepare. I had the gumbo, chicken and dumplings, and tortilla soup. I supplemented with the ready to eat chicken in the foil pouch from the grocery store.

[Redbad]

For a group of 4, a white gas stove would probably be equally as efficient and as heavy as a canister stove for heating water and/or cooking. You will need a minimum of 16oz/500ml of hot water per freeze dried meal which gets you into having to heat 2q/2l of water per hot meal and at that point the weight savings of having a canister stove starts eroding because of the need for additional canisters of fuel.

I can't say enough about having footwear that properly fits. Have several pairs of socks per person as well. Consider gaiters...

The numbers that you reference about packs is their size in liters. A 95l pack is a huge pack. A 65l pack is about the minimum for lightweight backpacking for 1 week or so. Again pack fit is very important, so try a few packs on to see what fits.

Tents are 1 size smaller than they are advertised IMHO. A 3 person tent fits 2 people and gear well. A 2 person tent fits 1 person and gear well. Etc.

Instead of thinking about sleeping bags, think about sleeping systems which include a sleeping bag and sleeping mat. Be prepared for overnight temperatures in the 30s, even in the summertime. But also be prepared for much warmer overnight temperatures. You want to be as comfortable as possible so that you can recover from the day's activities.

Tyvek sheeting from a big box home improvement store makes a very good groundcloth/ tarp and is much lighter weight than "regular" tarps and is much less expensive than a sil/nylon tarp. You may be able to custom cut the Tyvek if you can talk the store employee into letting you do that....

Filters: any 0.2 micron filter will work. Remember which hose is clean and which is contaminated....

Be prepared for 3 seasons on ISRO and possibly 3 seasons in one day.

When planning also keep in mind that you will want to have 1 additional day of food than the number of days you plan on being on the island in the event that the ferries don't run due to severe storm conditions (think waves in excess of 10 feet/ 3 meters). While this is not common, it does happen.

[nicadimus]

I was thinking a 3 man tent and then two hammocks?? They seem ultra comfortable and it would be kinda neat sleeping right out in the open!!!

What are people's thoughts on Hammocks? They look like they might be a pain to set up??

Thanks for all the suggestions so far!!!

Also, I was thinking of trying to freeze some steaks, bring them on the Voyageur two with the idea of having them for supper at McCargoe...kind of a nice first night meal? Thoughts?

[Ingo]

Also, I was thinking of trying to freeze some steaks, bring them on the Voyageur two with the idea of having them for supper at McCargoe...kind of a nice first night meal? Thoughts?

We've done that! We found some that came individually vacuumed sealed and froze them. For the trip up the day before (Duluth to G.P.) we wrapped them in newspaper and a large ziplock in the cooler, then unwrapped them before we got on the boat the next a.m. Great if you're otherwise bringing a frying pan. We did discover that someone needed to keep a hand on the pan at all times though, after it fell off (small stove, large skillet). There is a communal fire ring at McCargoe too, if you're into cooking on a fire.

[DonNewcomb]

#1-packs...dumb question but what do the numbers mean on the descriptions for packs...64, 40, etc..I'm looking for packs for 7-day ventures on average...plus I'm a chic...so not sure if the "girl" packs really are awesome for chics? Does it matter?

Women's packs are generally smaller and may be cut a bit wider at the hips. Avoid getting big packs as they are a temptation to overpack. You want everything small and light. As I've aged I've gone from trying to carry a 50 lb pack to trying to never go over 30 lbs.

#2-sleepingbags....I would love to plan trips for spring/summer/fall...taking those range of temps into consideration what should i be looking for??

First, they must fit and work for the way you sleep. If you sleep like a rock a sleeping bag can be kind of snug. If you toss and turn it needs to be roomier. I generally make at least one full revolution while sleeping. This is a big area to save weight but also an expensive one. A decent summer bag can be had for $50 if you catch it on sale or up to $350 or more for a real quality winter bag. Same for sleeping pads. Young folks spend $20 for a foam pad. All the old guys are packing a $100+ Thermarest.

#3-stoves...I'm not entirely sure my meal plan yet...I have no experience with freeze dried food(we spoiled ourselves with Spagetti dinners/burgers/or fresh fish in the BWCA)..but I'm thinking freeze dried should be an option for at least dinners...possibly some breakfasts(I hate oatneal)...I've read up on the fuel/stove debates and am thinking something small/lightweight...white gas..

If you don't have it yet, I'd suggest taking a single isobutane stove for 4 people. Last time I checked you could buy isobutane and white gas on the island but not kerosene or fuel alcohol. Isobutane is safe and easy.

#4-I would like to buy one hammock and give it a try, might work out kind of fun and we can rotate...sounds super comfy...recommendations? Do they come with bug nets?

I'm a big fan of hammock camping. My observation is that many camping spots on IR don't have convenient trees for hammocks. I'd stick with a tent for the times you can't get a hut and leave the hammock at home. The Hennessy Hammock is the modern version of the WWII jungle hammock and is, to my way of thinking, the best way to sleep in the woods.

#5- tarps? Lightweight?

You'll be surprised at what a good lightweight rain fly will cost.

#6- filters- any general recommendations?

My preference has been for a "Hiker's Friend" filter but AFAIK you can't buy one, you have to make it. The "Hiker's Friend" is a 30" waterproof "parachute" with a filter element attached in the center and about 6' of vinyl tubing. You fill the parachute with water and siphon the water through the filter into your clean-water bottle. No pump, you let gravity do the work.

#7- tents...

Also a huge area for weight savings. If you want, you can easily spend over $1000 on a nice 4-person tent. If you want to save weight, I suggest a good non-freestanding tent. The ribs used to make a tent freestanding are a large source of added weight. OTHO, you will probably be spending most of your nights on IR in a shelter, so how much do you really want to invest in a tent? Also, you will probably need to set the tent up and seal the seams before you take it backpacking.

[shelb]

First off: many people will give you different advise based on their background and their "hike." In fact, on the Appalachian Trail (AT), the saying goes, "hike your own hike" (HYOH). Thus, please take any information I provide and take some/leave some - based on YOUR hike!

My previous experience has been packing/canoeing into the BWCA...most of the gear for this was not necessarily light in nature(big bulky/waterproof portage packs)...bear proof food tub...coleman stove...etc..so I'm basicly needing to re-stock everything!!!! I'm hoping to plan a couple backpacking trips a year going forward so I'm looking for good recommendations for gear not only for this trip, but just good quality gear for the future also....
[My experience is only about 600 miles....270 on on the Appalachian Traiul (VI to PA - so far!) and the rest in Michigan (NCT). /color]

#1-packs...dumb question but what do the numbers mean on the descriptions for packs...64, 40, etc..I'm looking for packs for 7-day ventures on average...plus I'm a chic...so not sure if the "girl" packs really are awesome for chics? Does it matter?
Those numbers specify the amount each pack can carry. Honesty, you do not want more than a 55 - unless you are going to carry the whole family's change of clothing! I have a 55, and I was able to pack 11 days of supplies (AND FOOD!) in it, still having room. The larger your pack is, the more you will put in it! My husband has a 70 - ONLY because he Packs with a scout troop and he often carries a TON of extra weight for the new scouts who are 11 y/o and weigh about 50 pounds. (My 55 was plenty for me, my son with a 45, and another son with a school back-pack - to do 55 miles on the AT

#2-sleepingbags....I would love to plan trips for spring/summer/fall...taking those range of temps into consideration what should i be looking for??
Wow...big difference - depending on where you are. Summer in Virginia 0 ah, about 95 with 90% humidity. Summer in Isle Royale - huge difference. Summer at Pictured Rocks in Michigan - again, big difference! Regarding basics: same backpack, sleeping system: this is the biggest change: Wow, PM me or do searches for what you are looking at as it is a huge difference.

#3-stoves...I'm not entirely sure my meal plan yet...I have no experience with freeze dried food(we spoiled ourselves with Spagetti dinners/burgers/or fresh fish in the BWCA)..but I'm thinking freeze dried should be an option for at least dinners...possibly some breakfasts(I hate oatneal)...I've read up on the fuel/stove debates and am thinking something small/lightweight...white gas..
My suggestion would be to either go with a jet fuel type of gas (Jet Boil/MSR) or an alcohol stove. I have used a JetBoil for several years and "dabbled" in the others. Realize, that a JetBoil is a system that boils water - and DOES NOT cook your food. By this I mean, you should plan on using Freeze dried - packaged food - or be sure the food you bring can have boiling water added to cook. (Some foods need to be simmered, and this will not work. For examples of what you can do with a Jet Boil, just google "Freezer Bag" cooking - or contact me... You can eat WELL - by planning/making your own food (easy now with Lipton instant potato/rice mixtures) without spending the bucks on the Mountain House meals etc.
#4-I would like to buy one hammock and give it a try, might work out kind of fun and we can rotate...sounds super comfy...recommendations? Do they come with bug nets?

#5- tarps? Lightweight? I prefer a tent. My 2-person tent weighs 34 ounces. (just over 2 pounds). Honestly, I would prefer to bring a 4 -5 pound tent over a "tarp," but that is my opinion. I have spend too many continuous rainy days where a tarp would have meant I stayed wet.

#6- filters- any general recommendations? I had a MSR - (I need to look up which one). It SUCKED! Several different times, we had issues with it. Now, realize it was only this type.... and I can't advise now - but be careful. I have heard very good things about the Katadyn. I plan on using the Sawyer Squeeze and/or Aqua Mira (remember chemical treatments like AM will not work on IR!) from here out.

#7- tents... I recently bought a Rainbow... just over 2 pounds for 2 people - YEA! Until now, we carried a 5# tent for 2 people...boo... However, money dictated equipment - and whether we went.... most important thing is going!

You didn't mention the MOST IMPORTANT thing:
WEIGHT!!! My pack weighs 18 pounds without food or water for a summer hike with temps between 55 and 95. With water (2L) and food for 5 days, my pack weighs 27 pounds. THIS IS VERY IMPORTANT! If your pack is over 30#, sure - you might have fun, but put it this way - put four #10 bags of potatoes on your back for a whole trip - in addition to what you packed! ...... or put 5 gallons of milk in a bag on your back for the whole trip! Yes - it does make a difference.

If you want to see my packing list, drop me a PM, and I will send it to you.

Shelb
Thanks

Any and all recommendations are welcome..

FYI- I'm looking for awesome quality stuff...but saving cost would be nice also [/quote]

[hooky]

I'll chime in on the food question. I've recently decided that if I can't dehydrate it, then I don't need it. We've settled on some favorites: Breakfast is usually hash browns with turkey sausage. Suppers run the gamut, but it's hard to beat pasta with red or alfredo sauce and ground beef. Beef stroganhoff is another favorite. cous cous, red sauce and ground beef or turkey.

[alecto73]

From a food perspective, I used http://www.packitgourmet.com/ my last trip. They were all various degrees of delicious and very easy to prepare. I had the gumbo, chicken and dumplings, and tortilla soup. I supplemented with the ready to eat chicken in the foil pouch from the grocery store.

+1 on Packit Gourmet. Mmmmmm love the chicken and dumplings. They have everything from the meals to the base dried ingredients, condiments, cured meats, and cheeses which is pretty cool. I also like the Mac n' Cheese from Enertia - http://trailfoods.com/. I end up eating a lot of Mountain House though since I can grab it at REI at the last minute. Keep meaning to try http://www.hawkvittles.com/ too. I boil a little water in the morning for coffee and oatmeal. No stoves for lunch. I do the foil pouches of tuna or summer sausage, cheese, peanut butter, that sort of thing. There's a fair amount of science to what you eat when if you really get after it on the hikes. I should be trying it but I don't. You may want to look into that a bit as it pertains to meal planning.